As we continue to move forward in a time of unprecedented change, we are all looking for ways to support students new to the virtual setting. To address questions on this topic, we hosted a panel discussion in partnership with The Chronicle of Higher Education to discuss practical tips and strategies for delivering quality experiences to virtual learners.
Topics of Discussion
During this discussion, leaders from Wiley University Services, the University of West Alabama, and Concordia University, St. Paul, shared:
- Tips and tools for enhancing engagement in new platforms.
- Strategies for evolving assessment in virtual learning environments.
- Mindful approaches to advising students during times of uncertainty.
Stream the Webinar
Delivering Quality Student Experiences in Virtual Learning Environments
00:00:01.199 –> 00:00:11.219
Michael Anft: Hello and welcome to today’s webinar delivering quality student experiences in virtual learning environments, brought to you by Wiley University Services.
00:00:11.639 –> 00:00:23.610
Michael Anft: I’m Michael Anft from the Chronicle of Higher Education. I’ll be your moderator. Today, we’ll be tapping four experts who you’ll meet in a moment to discuss how students can best learn in the virtual education space.
00:00:24.240 –> 00:00:30.330
Michael Anft: First, I wanted to talk a little bit about this moment where we are right now in terms of virtual learning.
00:00:31.110 –> 00:00:42.090
Michael Anft: We’re living at a time when, across the country, K through 12 school systems and higher ed institutions are returning to virtual systems as the nation deals with a global pandemic.
00:00:42.570 –> 00:00:48.960
Michael Anft: At this moment, educational institutions simply have to use virtual tools to fulfill their function to society.
00:00:49.830 –> 00:00:55.650
Michael Anft: I kept key component to this as being able to continue to provide quality experiences to students.
00:00:56.220 –> 00:01:03.600
Michael Anft: By both delivering courses in an engaging way and supporting students as they navigate through these times of uncertainty and change.
00:01:04.110 –> 00:01:08.610
Michael Anft: With many universities, making the system, the decision that summer courses will be virtual
00:01:09.210 –> 00:01:15.990
Michael Anft: And with fall courses still in question, we need to look at ways to continue to improve these experiences for learners.
00:01:16.620 –> 00:01:32.940
Michael Anft: Today’s webinar will give you some tips on how to do just that. As we proceed during the next hour, you can engage with us on Twitter during the webinar, using the hashtag virtual learning chat, all one word, you’ll see it in the slide that’s up on your screen now.
00:01:33.960 –> 00:01:40.920
Michael Anft: If you’ve done webinars before you’re probably used to seeing a whole parade of slides throughout the presentation.
00:01:41.190 –> 00:01:47.730
Michael Anft: Because this is a Zoom meeting and the panelists are visible throughout, we were not going to be doing many slides. We wanted to see the
00:01:47.970 –> 00:01:54.420
Michael Anft: give and take, back and forth, the ideas that these people are presenting. So, we’re keeping the slides to a minimum.
00:01:55.170 –> 00:02:06.690
Michael Anft: During the last 15 minutes of our webinar, we’ll be answering questions registrants had asked about this topic. So, let’s get started by talking to our panelists, you’ll see them up on your screen right now.
00:02:10.020 –> 00:02:23.910
Michael Anft: Let’s learn about the role they play in delivering virtual experiences to students. David Migliorese, Vice President of Academic Services at Wiley University Services, tell us what it is that you do.
00:02:24.150 –> 00:02:33.720
David Migliorese: Yeah, hi everybody. So, Wiley, in addition to our research and publishing businesses, we partner with 60 different universities to market, deliver, and support fully online degree programs.
00:02:34.320 –> 00:02:45.360
David Migliorese: In the context of that business, I lead a team of online learning specialists in technology, design, video production, etc. that partner with faculty to design and deliver their courses.
00:02:46.500 –> 00:02:47.670
David Migliorese: Excited to be here, Michael.
00:02:48.300 –> 00:02:59.250
Michael Anft: Well, terrific, David. Thanks so much and welcome. Let’s move on to Julie Delich, the Vice President of Retention and Student Support Services at Wiley University Services. Julie, can you tell us about your work in this area.
00:02:59.700 –> 00:03:09.570
Julie Delich: Thank you. Happy to. Hi, everyone. So, I have the pleasure of working with the team that supports students at Wiley University Services from the moment students register for classes
00:03:09.870 –> 00:03:16.620
Julie Delich: all the way through till graduation, and hopefully encouraging them to continue on from there. My background includes
00:03:17.100 –> 00:03:28.650
Julie Delich: master’s in clinical psychology. So, hear that bias coming out in some of my answers. So, I thought I’d forewarn everyone about that. I’ve also taught adjunct online and on-campus classes. Thank you, Michael.
00:03:29.670 –> 00:03:39.600
Michael Anft: Thank you Julie. It’s a pleasure to have Jan Miller with us as well. She’s Dean for the College of Education, as well as the Dean for the Division of Online Programs at the University of West Alabama.
00:03:40.200 –> 00:03:46.440
Michael Anft: Welcome, Jen. Could you give us an idea about the role you play in delivering virtual learning experiences at West Alabama?
00:03:46.800 –> 00:03:53.640
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Absolutely. Thank you. Yes, I do wear two hats. So, I serve as the Dean of the College of Ed and as the Dean for Online
00:03:54.300 –> 00:04:00.480
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Programs. And so, with that, I get to work with students across the whole campus, across the whole university, and all colleges.
00:04:00.690 –> 00:04:10.620
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, you know, while I predominantly work with College of Ed, I have the opportunity to network with other colleges, so I support all the colleges in our online programs across campus.
00:04:12.030 –> 00:04:22.140
Michael Anft: Great. Thanks, Jan. Last but not least, we’re also joined by Janina Cich, Criminal Justice Program Director and professor of Criminal Justice and Forensic Behavioral Health programs
00:04:22.500 –> 00:04:29.670
Michael Anft: at Concordia University, St. Paul. Janina, can you tell us how your work involves virtual learning included and what you do?
00:04:30.870 –> 00:04:35.490
Janina Cich: Absolutely. Thank you. And it’s great to be here. I’m very excited that we’re able to collaborate
00:04:36.030 –> 00:04:43.800
Janina Cich: I am the criminal justice chair, but I’ve been teaching since 2003 in the criminal justice and forensic behavioral health realm.
00:04:44.460 –> 00:04:55.110
Janina Cich: I have retired from over two decades in the criminal justice field of service. So, I bring some experience, along with the education within our realm and
00:04:55.560 –> 00:05:04.950
Janina Cich: look forward to all of the creativity that we have put into our programs over the last couple of years for an online and face-to-face,
00:05:05.490 –> 00:05:14.340
Janina Cich: blended system, so to speak. So, that really helped us navigate to this very quickly triage that we just recently went through because of the pandemic.
00:05:14.790 –> 00:05:28.980
Janina Cich: I’m also a CEO of a business that provides education and training to different professionals and the fields of service of medical and education and social service and criminal justice and law
00:05:29.490 –> 00:05:38.970
Janina Cich: to bridge that gap of forensic behavioral health and some of those responses which, I think, blends really nicely with how we’re responding to each other and our students during this. Thank you.
00:05:39.780 –> 00:05:46.080
Michael Anft: Thank you. Thank you all for being here, lot of expertise here. This is going to be exciting.
00:05:46.830 –> 00:05:58.200
Michael Anft: Before we go on, maybe we can take a step back a little bit and talk about what exactly virtual learning is, what the scope and range of it is, how it’s applicable in the university or college setting.
00:05:59.580 –> 00:06:01.230
Michael Anft: If anybody want to take a whack at that.
00:06:03.330 –> 00:06:07.920
David Migliorese: Yeah, yeah, I’m happy to do that. I mean, I, I’d love to hear other perspectives as well, but
00:06:08.280 –> 00:06:15.420
David Migliorese: this became a really hot topic on my team when Jonathan Zimmerman suggested in the New York Times that we should be studying this COVID-era online teaching
00:06:15.660 –> 00:06:22.740
David Migliorese: as a comparison to face-to-face teaching, to try to learn about the value of it, et cetera, and there was a lot of concern in my community at that suggestion.
00:06:24.060 –> 00:06:32.070
David Migliorese: You know, for context, we developed hundreds of custom courses every year with our partner institutions, and we’ve been doing so since the early 2000s.
00:06:32.850 –> 00:06:39.780
David Migliorese: When, when we develop a course, we lead faculty through a process. It’s about four to six months long in advance of when they teach for the first time.
00:06:40.650 –> 00:06:50.700
David Migliorese: They work with a course design specialist plus technology specialist media producers, oftentimes, and they plan a student experience that’s optimized for the conditions of online learners. So,
00:06:51.180 –> 00:07:01.530
David Migliorese: that includes what technologies are leveraged and how they’re leveraged, how content will be presented, what students are going to do actively to engage with the concepts that they’re learning, and you know, be assessed and
00:07:01.890 –> 00:07:09.570
David Migliorese: demonstrate that they’ve learned, how faculty to manage the learning community of the course. All these things that we’ve come to understand as best practice
00:07:10.350 –> 00:07:20.250
David Migliorese: based online learning. And this is the kind of thing that’s done all over the country by hundreds of universities that have online programs as well as companies, like ours, that support them.
00:07:21.060 –> 00:07:29.400
David Migliorese: The remote teaching that’s happening now is sort of taking a live course midstream and rapidly adapting it to work via Zoom or the LMS or other tools, and
00:07:29.610 –> 00:07:35.370
David Migliorese: I like how Janina put it, that it’s sort of a triage scenario where you’re trying to make stuff work in the time that you have.
00:07:35.670 –> 00:07:40.950
David Migliorese: And I think there’s been heroic work done right. There’s some really great and exciting things happening in those classes.
00:07:41.490 –> 00:07:44.520
David Migliorese: But also, some even quality and some missed opportunities.
00:07:44.820 –> 00:07:53.460
David Migliorese: And we’re here to work with folks from, you know, where they are today and figure out how to elevate what they’ve done. Excited that everybody’s teaching online now, but there’s definitely more that could be done.
00:07:53.880 –> 00:07:59.760
David Migliorese: Bottom line, the sort of classes that have been moved online so rapidly weren’t designed to be taught online.
00:08:00.540 –> 00:08:07.740
David Migliorese: They’re sort of improvised experience delivered by people who didn’t really choose to teach or learn online, which I think makes a difference, too.
00:08:08.370 –> 00:08:18.510
David Migliorese: And so, you know, for us in our community to compare that kind of learning to face-to-face learning and kind of make proclamations about whether online learning is of quality or can be effective
00:08:18.870 –> 00:08:29.850
David Migliorese: is sort of inappropriate, right? In the big picture, of course, online learning is not new. And it’s not really an unanswered question whether or not it can be effective. There’s been a lot of research into this, it absolutely can be effective.
00:08:31.530 –> 00:08:37.950
David Migliorese: And for me, there’s — there was a recent article and edgy cause a group of faculty and researchers published a comprehensive response to the Zimmerman
00:08:38.220 –> 00:08:44.430
David Migliorese: article that I won’t go into. But for me, you know, there’s kind of a common sensical point to underscore, which is that
00:08:44.880 –> 00:08:53.940
David Migliorese: online learning is not one thing, just like face-to-face learning is not one thing. There’s a range of different models in teaching and learning of all modalities, and for me,
00:08:54.840 –> 00:09:08.250
David Migliorese: you know, looking into what those effective practices are given the context on either side of the fence or in between is a much more effective use of our efforts to try to figure out how to navigate the future that we find ourselves in so quickly. Right.
00:09:08.730 –> 00:09:17.190
Michael Anft: And I, not to sound crass, but this this time also may offer some opportunity to further hone those metrics about
00:09:17.850 –> 00:09:19.770
Michael Anft: effectiveness, etc. Right.
00:09:20.430 –> 00:09:27.960
David Migliorese: I think so, yeah, and even to create different categories to study right versus just the kind of broadest highest level of online versus not.
00:09:29.130 –> 00:09:34.770
Michael Anft: Right. Terrific. Thanks, David. Anybody else want to chime in on that or did he cover it?
00:09:38.100 –> 00:09:43.680
Michael Anft: Okay, let’s move on to our first topic today supporting the move from on-campus to virtual learning environments.
00:09:44.190 –> 00:09:54.570
Michael Anft: David, again we’re hearing the terms quote “virtual learning” and a quote again “remote learning” being used to describe the learning environments that schools have been migrating to over the years,
00:09:54.960 –> 00:10:00.510
Michael Anft: Or last few weeks. How do they differ from traditional online courses, as we’ve come to know them.
00:10:01.530 –> 00:10:09.330
David Migliorese: I mean, I think it is largely a matter of kind of improvisation versus a lot of upfront planning and
00:10:10.410 –> 00:10:16.710
David Migliorese: what that means for the actual execution. Right. It’s hard to plan and design and also facilitate all in the same week
00:10:17.430 –> 00:10:27.810
David Migliorese: You may not have had a course that was organized that way to begin with. So, I think there’s some difficulty there, but I’d be interested in hearing from others as to what they’ve seen on their campuses and how this is actually playing out for you.
00:10:33.330 –> 00:10:34.740
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Yeah, I would love to, um.
00:10:35.400 –> 00:10:48.030
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We have obviously face-to-face and online classes. And so, we are a SACS institution. And so, we really pride ourselves on trying to make our own campus and our online classes look and feel the same as much as possible.
00:10:48.330 –> 00:11:01.020
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And so, where we can make that happen, it’s just fantastic. David, when you mentioned about adding the media component to an online class, adding, you know, some of the features in an online class where we’re finding our own campus faculty
00:11:01.470 –> 00:11:12.900
Dr. Jan G. Miller: or, you know, they appreciate some of the media and some of the engagement because they can sort of do pre-work on the front end. So, last lecture time, students can come prepared, you know, kind of flipped the learning model, and so
00:11:13.170 –> 00:11:19.050
Dr. Jan G. Miller: that development of our online classes, it’s absolutely impacted our own campus face-to-face classes.
00:11:22.140 –> 00:11:28.440
Michael Anft: While you were speaking, there with a sudden moves the virtual learning. What are some of the concerns universities are dealing with right now?
00:11:29.040 –> 00:11:38.490
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Yeah, I can tell you at our university, and we are regional institution and so we have a lot of first generation students. And so, I did want to just briefly mention
00:11:38.790 –> 00:11:46.710
Dr. Jan G. Miller: You know, when you’re dealing with first generation students, and those are many students that have to work while they go to school,
00:11:47.040 –> 00:11:52.200
Dr. Jan G. Miller: many of these students are working in essential jobs, such as in grocery stores, fast food,
00:11:52.590 –> 00:12:05.160
Dr. Jan G. Miller: convenience stores, and so, I mean, they are on the line of duty every day. And they’re being impacted, you know, daily because of the jobs that they do. And now they’re, you know, many have left campus to go back home
00:12:05.700 –> 00:12:15.030
Dr. Jan G. Miller: so that they can be safe. And so, they’re having to, you know, all of a sudden, take what I signed up for face-to-face classes to now an online environment and so
00:12:15.570 –> 00:12:21.750
Dr. Jan G. Miller: quickly, when we saw that what was happening across the nation and the pandemic, how it was quickly spreading,
00:12:22.050 –> 00:12:29.430
Dr. Jan G. Miller: our university took a very bold step and our President, you know, he was very transparent, lots of constant communication.
00:12:29.700 –> 00:12:42.180
Dr. Jan G. Miller: You know, we were all urged to poll our students. And so, we did so by colleges, by departments — we reached out to find out, Do you have needs? Are there things we can do, you know, right now to help you? And so
00:12:42.570 –> 00:12:54.420
Dr. Jan G. Miller: with those first-generation students, many were now taking their cell phones and that became their laptop or their computer. So, they’re trying to navigate Blackboard or, you know, whatever LMS on their personal device.
00:12:54.690 –> 00:13:04.890
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Many of them didn’t have a data package plan large enough, you know, to do some of this. And so again, our students are very resourceful. They were able to find Wi-Fi.
00:13:05.490 –> 00:13:10.260
Dr. Jan G. Miller: In while McDonald’s and Burger King and Starbucks — and some of these may be closed.
00:13:10.620 –> 00:13:24.150
Dr. Jan G. Miller: They have drafters, and their parking lots are empty. So, you can still access Wi-Fi, so they were very creative. You know, finding that Wi-Fi. We are a very rural location, so Wi-Fi is a, you know, prime thing you need.
00:13:24.870 –> 00:13:31.800
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, definitely we’ve been trying to take care of those needs. We did have some things in place already like a food pantry.
00:13:32.340 –> 00:13:39.330
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, when the pandemic hit, we knew that we were going to have students in need of food. And so, we quickly created a link where people could donate.
00:13:39.990 –> 00:13:48.690
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, we needed to, you know, up our supply there. And so that’s been wonderful. Also, the university created what we’re calling an emergency student fund.
00:13:48.990 –> 00:13:55.200
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So when students have a need, there’s a process, and we don’t want them to go without. We want to support them all that we can.
00:13:55.740 –> 00:14:04.320
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Another thing that we did, we provided training for our students before they left campus. So, how do you navigate an online class? What does it look like?
00:14:04.620 –> 00:14:19.260
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And you know, not to our surprise, our students were really well versed in online learning. Many of them took online learning classes at in high school or correspondence, or you know, some classes like that, too. They really adapted quite well.
00:14:19.830 –> 00:14:30.810
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Our bookstore made all books available to students for free through the eBook version. So, that was very nice. Some of our first-generation students share books among, you know, friends so
00:14:31.470 –> 00:14:42.510
Dr. Jan G. Miller: that was very, very helpful. Also, we kept our computer labs open, said that if you do live close to campus and you need to access a computer or Wi-Fi, you know, you could drop in, and they’re open.
00:14:42.960 –> 00:14:49.260
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We’ve got our schedules posted, and we’ve sent that to students, and that’s been very helpful to our students.
00:14:50.100 –> 00:14:53.370
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Lastly, I wanted just to talk quickly about our faculty concerns.
00:14:53.940 –> 00:14:59.430
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We did have some that — we do have some faculty who have never taught online, who were nervous and scared to teach online.
00:14:59.760 –> 00:15:02.550
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And so, how do you transition and get them prepared?
00:15:02.880 –> 00:15:14.100
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We were lucky, if you call it lucky, that spring break sort of hit perfect timing for us. So, we extended spring break by a week so the students actually received a two week spring break.
00:15:14.310 –> 00:15:25.110
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And during that two week is when we did the onboarding with our faculty. So, we are lucky that we have a strong instructional support department of five people. We have three instructional designers.
00:15:25.410 –> 00:15:30.630
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We have one that’s exclusively with remote proctor dealing with testing. And then we have a director.
00:15:30.960 –> 00:15:41.790
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And during that two-week onboarding process, we were able to provide training. But most of all, we provided individualized training by person because of what we found.
00:15:42.150 –> 00:15:52.290
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Faculty were from zero to 10 on their capabilities. And so, when you try to do training that fits all, you miss most people. You know, you’re training to the middle, so
00:15:52.740 –> 00:16:04.380
Dr. Jan G. Miller: we did a lot of individualized training. We got zoom for everyone. We talked about, How do you give feedback to students? Because face to face, we can do that online. It’s a little different, and so
00:16:04.920 –> 00:16:08.520
Dr. Jan G. Miller: one big best practice we talked about was final exams are coming up.
00:16:08.820 –> 00:16:18.270
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We have a final exam schedule, but in an online environment, you really need to leave those class exams open for a period of time, not show up on Tuesday at 10 a.m.
00:16:18.600 –> 00:16:33.960
Dr. Jan G. Miller: You know, again, because of technical difficulties on devices. So, we’ve learned a lot through this process. And I think these lessons learned are going to be important because we’re going to move forward with summer classes being online, as well. So, I think we’re skilled up and ready.
00:16:34.800 –> 00:16:42.900
Michael Anft: Have you been able to maintain your student population? Through all this, is offering a lot of support is what helps keep numbers?
00:16:43.170 –> 00:16:47.700
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Yeah, so far, we’re okay. I mean, we’ve been in constant communication with our students.
00:16:48.060 –> 00:16:56.010
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And we’ve provided a lot of online tutorials. And so, that’s been the biggest thing, I think, for our success, is the fact that we have been transparent.
00:16:56.310 –> 00:17:10.770
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We tried to keep the lines of communication open. When there’s a need, you know, let’s take care where we can. And we’re a small institution, and we can probably do things that larger institutions cannot. So, so far, our enrollment is okay. We’re steady.
00:17:11.370 –> 00:17:13.650
Michael Anft: Well, that’s great. What is the enrollment there?
00:17:14.070 –> 00:17:21.480
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We have about 5,500 students, but about 3,500 our online. And so, the other 2,000 are campus-based.
00:17:21.780 –> 00:17:29.160
Michael Anft: Right. Okay. So, you’re well versed in this to begin with, which is a great experience to have. Thank you, Jen. Let’s move on to our second topic.
00:17:29.760 –> 00:17:36.810
Michael Anft: Creating quality experiences for students and virtual learning environments. I’m going to ask for the Wiley people, David and Julie,
00:17:37.560 –> 00:17:47.580
Michael Anft: to respond to my first question on this, which is we have seen a number of questions come in from administrators and faculty members asking how to keep students engaged.
00:17:47.970 –> 00:17:56.730
Michael Anft: In this sudden — during the sudden shift to virtual learning, what are some key ingredients that lead to quality student experiences that can keep them studying, keep them in —
00:17:56.820 –> 00:18:03.480
David Migliorese: Their programs? Yeah. Can — I can start and then Julie, you want to follow, then? I think like,
00:18:03.960 –> 00:18:11.220
David Migliorese: so there’s a teaching answer to this, another course design answer to this. And there’s a student support answer to this. So, there’s, there’s a lot of angles here.
00:18:11.820 –> 00:18:18.840
David Migliorese: For me, from a design perspective. There are some sort of table stakes that you’ve got to have in place, like setting the right expectations of students.
00:18:19.410 –> 00:18:25.890
David Migliorese: Having the learning objectives clear for everybody, having assessments designed into the courses that are authentic to those objectives,
00:18:26.220 –> 00:18:40.440
David Migliorese: having a good mix of those assessments. So people kind of know where they are, as they move through the course — just organizing the course in a way that suits the time that you have left and intervals that are sort of spreading out the workload evenly across the weeks is important.
00:18:41.490 –> 00:18:50.520
David Migliorese: But like, after all those kinds of things, it’s really about engagement, as you mentioned, Michael. And the way we think about engagement in the design process is in three categories.
00:18:50.940 –> 00:18:57.720
David Migliorese: One is through content engagement. So, how are students going to engage with the content of your course there? There’s a myriad of ways, set of ways, to do that.
00:18:58.230 –> 00:19:09.180
David Migliorese: Some more active than others. And we try to mix that up and keep it active as much as possible. It doesn’t always have to be on you to deliver all the content right, and there’s an art and figuring out the balance there.
00:19:09.840 –> 00:19:19.740
David Migliorese: The next category would be engagement with peers. So, you don’t want to overlook the fact that students are working with each other, and even more so, probably, in an online setting than you even notice.
00:19:20.550 –> 00:19:25.200
David Migliorese: But you can leverage that right, like you can set up study groups for people, you can partner people.
00:19:26.070 –> 00:19:30.930
David Migliorese: You know, you can have discussions and prompts for folks to keep them engaged across the weeks.
00:19:31.320 –> 00:19:39.060
David Migliorese: I think all that stuff is really important in normal times, and even more now when people are all very new to this and kind of navigating it fresh
00:19:39.990 –> 00:19:44.550
David Migliorese: for the first time. So, I look at that peer engagement, and I will get instructor engagement.
00:19:45.540 –> 00:19:52.500
David Migliorese: In the classroom, it’s really easy to see whether you’ve got your students’ attention and how well you’re sort of navigating and leading them through
00:19:52.800 –> 00:19:59.400
David Migliorese: content and activities and things. Online, it’s a little bit harder. And you also don’t want to burn yourself out by trying to do too much, right? So,
00:20:00.030 –> 00:20:08.160
David Migliorese: we try to strategize for balance between those different categories of engagement. So, students are having, you know, a great time. Great.
00:20:08.730 –> 00:20:23.940
David Migliorese: Good and sort of a fulfilling time working with the content itself, a healthy way to work with peers, and also enough engagement with the instructor that they feel like someone cares about their success and is looking out for them. And it’s also their 30-day question, etc.
00:20:25.410 –> 00:20:28.470
David Migliorese: You know, and I think that’s sort of the big picture for us.
00:20:28.860 –> 00:20:36.630
David Migliorese: I mean, back to online learning not being just one thing. There’s lots of different ways to set up these balances, and there are different models that can be successful
00:20:36.960 –> 00:20:43.800
David Migliorese: depending on what you’re teaching and, you know, the level of your students, and all kinds of different things. But I mean, most of the time,
00:20:44.220 –> 00:20:49.740
David Migliorese: we designed very relational, small class size types of instructional strategies.
00:20:50.370 –> 00:20:57.630
David Migliorese: There are also higher scale models that you can leverage off the shelf — adaptive learning systems, for instance — to engage folks with content
00:20:57.930 –> 00:21:09.030
David Migliorese: in a way that’s really effective, you know, and then augment that with some personal touch, as well. So again, wide range of options here. But we think about those three categories of engagement: content, peers, and instructors
00:21:11.820 –> 00:21:13.680
David Migliorese: Who are doing this all the time. Julie?
00:21:14.010 –> 00:21:20.340
Julie Delich: Yeah, I want to just jump right on something David said that’s so critical. He said, It’s knowing someone cares,
00:21:20.760 –> 00:21:30.000
Julie Delich: right? So, in this environment right now, students are dealing with so much disruption. The best quality student experience we can provide is that outreach,
00:21:30.210 –> 00:21:36.810
Julie Delich: proactively reaching out before they look like they’re in trouble. Don’t assume they’re okay just because they’re posting.
00:21:37.050 –> 00:21:41.160
Julie Delich: Don’t assume they’re okay because, in class, they were always raising their hand.
00:21:41.400 –> 00:21:53.190
Julie Delich: This is a whole different environment. So, reach out proactively whenever possible, whether it’s faculty reaching out or an advisor or anyone on the campus staff that can do this outreach.
00:21:53.520 –> 00:22:04.170
Julie Delich: And make it as personalized of an outreach as you possibly can. So again, people know that you care. The students feel that sense of being cared for and thought about.
00:22:04.740 –> 00:22:15.540
Julie Delich: The other thing that I think is critical, in addition to the care, is sharing resources before the students ask. Jan talked a lot about that, what the University of West Alabama is doing.
00:22:16.110 –> 00:22:26.640
Julie Delich: But I’m thinking here about sharing resources for support. So, if you have a counseling center on campus, share that information and how to access their virtual tools.
00:22:27.000 –> 00:22:36.810
Julie Delich: If you can look into and talk to your counseling center about what is the national suicide hotline that we would recommend, what is the national mental health hotlines and crisis hotlines.
00:22:37.170 –> 00:22:50.130
Julie Delich: Get that in front of your students before they ask for it and do it repeatedly. So just because you said it once via email, doesn’t mean everybody absorbed it, so sharing that kind of information proactively,
00:22:50.430 –> 00:22:56.580
Julie Delich: personally, and before it’s needed is really the key to having an engaging student experience.
00:22:58.110 –> 00:22:58.470
Julie Delich: Great.
00:22:58.740 –> 00:23:08.940
Janina Cich: Thanks. I, just to chime in quick, if you don’t mind, I love the fact that both of you have brought up the whole idea of intentional. Now that we can take a little time to pause,
00:23:09.420 –> 00:23:18.660
Janina Cich: I think we were overloaded with the collaboration and the sharing resources that a lot of instructors just almost shut down because there was so much information out there.
00:23:18.960 –> 00:23:24.210
Janina Cich: And they didn’t understand the transition as well as engagement. So, it’s important that we’re intentional.
00:23:24.660 –> 00:23:30.900
Janina Cich: And another good source, as David had mentioned earlier about student and student interaction. It’s really
00:23:31.470 –> 00:23:36.360
Janina Cich: easy to have a student mentor other students or have a buddy system in a classroom, as well,
00:23:36.660 –> 00:23:49.950
Janina Cich: so that you all feel like you’re going through this life adversity together, and you can overcome this and build some of those resiliency skill sets. This is life. It’s real life, and it’s important for us to also embrace that.
00:23:51.660 –> 00:23:53.070
Michael Anft: Great, thanks. Janina.
00:23:54.120 –> 00:24:04.620
Michael Anft: I also like to hear what you have to say regarding tips for faculty and for engagement from the faculty standpoint, beyond what you’ve already shared.
00:24:05.700 –> 00:24:11.220
Michael Anft: Are there other ways for faculty to kind of reach out to students and make sure that they’re getting what’s being offered?
00:24:13.350 –> 00:24:21.330
Janina Cich: Absolutely. I think that this transition has really prompted our instructors to be creative and how they’re engaging, so they’re making
00:24:21.660 –> 00:24:27.750
Janina Cich: prerecorded videos that they’re sending out in announcements, and they’re reaching out via email and text message.
00:24:28.470 –> 00:24:42.390
Janina Cich: They’re also chunking the material into bite-sized pieces and incorporating some of that multimedia that maybe they didn’t incorporate earlier that really takes the content, bridges it to practical application.
00:24:43.020 –> 00:24:52.890
Janina Cich: That’s really been helpful. They’ve also transitioned guest speakers that were coming to the classrooms and having them come into the collaborate classroom or prerecording
00:24:53.520 –> 00:24:58.380
Janina Cich: their particular content and then having discussion breakouts down the road.
00:24:58.770 –> 00:25:10.260
Janina Cich: They’ve also used some gamma phi tools which has really been helpful. So, if they’re having a lecture like this, and they’re talking to one another. They can also send out a poll through the LMS system or even
00:25:10.680 –> 00:25:18.450
Janina Cich: through the cell phones that John had mentioned, they’re using quite frequently with CAHOOTS or blinkers or Poll Everywhere.
00:25:18.840 –> 00:25:30.030
Janina Cich: So, there are a lot of different resources that our instructors are being creative with in engaging that’s in students within the class and bridging content to real-world application.
00:25:31.020 –> 00:25:33.480
Michael Anft: A lot of polling apps in higher education these days.
00:25:34.320 –> 00:25:39.270
Dr. Jan G. Miller: I just wanted to chime in, to, to say I see that faculty are being more collaborative than ever.
00:25:39.540 –> 00:25:54.450
Dr. Jan G. Miller: You know, so when I find a cool tool to share it with my colleagues, and then, you know, we’ll hop on a Zoom and demonstrate. So, I see a lot of collaboration. Not that we didn’t have it before, but it’s almost to a different level. And so that’s also inspiring. Right. Okay, great.
00:25:54.480 –> 00:26:00.660
Michael Anft: Thanks for sharing that. I’m going to throw the next question out to all four of you. We have seen shakeups
00:26:01.140 –> 00:26:16.380
Michael Anft: and certain types of hands-on activities. Some students need to graduate talking about labs, practicums, internships, have these kinds of experiences and even around how tests are being administered. How are we seeing those types of issues handled?
00:26:19.860 –> 00:26:28.680
David Migliorese: Yeah, yeah. We get asked that question a lot, and like, the unfortunate thing is that there are some things that can only be learned hands on. Right. I think we all have to accept that.
00:26:29.640 –> 00:26:35.610
David Migliorese: And you know, you might struggle to find alternatives to things like labs or clinical, patient contact type activities.
00:26:36.270 –> 00:26:43.140
David Migliorese: But I think the guidance around any of those things is that you kind of have to start and rethink what you’re evaluating and what options you have
00:26:43.530 –> 00:26:55.740
David Migliorese: at your disposal to evaluate them and you might not be able to evaluate every aspect of a skill or competency set that you’re trying to teach, but you might be able to assess 60% of them and then figure out a solution down the road for the rest.
00:26:56.670 –> 00:27:05.460
David Migliorese: You know, what we’re seeing is, you know, exams are being rethought quite a bit, that people are very concerned about security around exams at stress around exams.
00:27:05.850 –> 00:27:15.900
David Migliorese: And a lot of times when you step back, you can think of a more authentic way to assess a lot of what you’re testing. Anyway, so you know projects, writing assignments, video assignments.
00:27:17.130 –> 00:27:21.570
David Migliorese: You know, we’ve — there are folks who do like role play activities in front of classes and,
00:27:21.930 –> 00:27:34.320
David Migliorese: you know, we’ve converted those, like, okay, shoot a role play video with somebody and then other students can analyze that and there’s some sort of assessment of how they can read that interaction and what they’re able to demonstrate there.
00:27:35.460 –> 00:27:40.560
David Migliorese: In terms of, like, labs and, you know, there are a lot of products out there. So, you know,
00:27:40.800 –> 00:27:47.190
David Migliorese: depending on what you’re teaching – physics, bio, etc. And there are actually a lot of products out there, and they’ll send you a kit that you can work within your house.
00:27:47.580 –> 00:27:54.240
David Migliorese: Again, there are limits, too, that might not work for a chemistry class or something like that. But there are some things there
00:27:54.840 –> 00:28:05.190
David Migliorese: for soft skills kinds of learning. There are simulation products, there’s even virtual reality type things where, you know, virtual reality interviewing, for instance, or
00:28:06.210 –> 00:28:18.000
David Migliorese: that kind of a thing. And of course, there’s room for lots of things. So, I mean, to me, the key to making these kinds of decisions is just to understand your objectives and really think hard about what you’re testing or what you’re trying to teach
00:28:18.990 –> 00:28:21.600
David Migliorese: And figure out what you can do with what you have to work with, you know.
00:28:22.170 –> 00:28:23.340
00:28:25.140 –> 00:28:25.920
Michael Anft: Anyone else?
00:28:31.980 –> 00:28:32.310
00:28:33.420 –> 00:28:41.910
Janina Cich: I just wanted to follow up with what David had said. I know that we are dealing with a lot of the labs, the scenario-based education globally.
00:28:42.270 –> 00:28:55.740
Janina Cich: In speaking to some colleagues and Australia and also here, we’ve noticed a huge change and fear factor for how these students are going to actually learn these skill sets, especially when we’re putting them out there in the real world and career
00:28:56.250 –> 00:29:16.980
Janina Cich : readiness. And I noticed that, for one in particular here in Minnesota, the governor just recently approved that our Minnesota peace officer licensing skills Academy is going to be going back to face to face in May, but on a limited plane. So right now, administrators are
00:29:18.210 –> 00:29:26.400
Janina Cich: trying to put together some sort of a strategy and how much can we actually put in our LMS system to teach them the classroom activity as well as
00:29:26.760 –> 00:29:35.580
Janina Cich: How can we be creative, as David had mentioned earlier, and having them perform some of these very valuable skill sets that they will need to use hands on instruction.
00:29:35.880 –> 00:29:44.370
Janina Cich: So, I think we’re starting to see those variables. I know that there are a lot of challenges with us not only teaching them in the lab, so to speak.
00:29:44.730 –> 00:29:53.490
Janina Cich: But also, what does that mean for them and transitioning to career readiness skill sets? I think that application is really huge and how we’re translating
00:29:54.330 –> 00:29:59.070
Janina Cich: what we’re teaching them to real world practice, and a lot of our educators in
00:29:59.490 –> 00:30:05.580
Janina Cich: our college really have been implementing some of those strategies and how they can take that real world
00:30:05.820 –> 00:30:16.320
Janina Cich: practical application activity and bring it into the classroom so that we can bridge that content with what’s really happening out there, and David made a great point about some of the tools.
00:30:17.070 –> 00:30:24.270
Janina Cich: All of our students, pretty much, have a cell phone. So, we’ve been doing a lot of video recording and audio recording and uploading those into
00:30:24.660 –> 00:30:33.720
Janina Cich: our LMS platform and doing some discussions, which has really opened up a lot of conversation amongst students. So, all of that has really been helpful.
00:30:36.450 –> 00:30:44.190
Julie Delich: And to add to that, from a very practical perspective, we’ve seen with a lot of our partners moving, of course, schedules as much as possible.
00:30:44.370 –> 00:30:55.020
Julie Delich: So, delaying internships and practicums whenever there’s that availability. I know they often come at the end of a program. So, it’s not always an option, but whenever it is, we’ve been trying to take that option, as well.
00:30:55.350 –> 00:31:03.060
Julie Delich: And then just being mindful of some of the flexible standards that are out there. Now, a lot of the accrediting bodies for nursing and social work and
00:31:03.300 –> 00:31:19.290
Julie Delich: clinical mental health have come out with some guidance on ways to adapt to more virtual training experiences and given more flexibility in those requirements. So, just keeping up-to-date on what those changes are is a really kind of practical approach to handling some of these challenges.
00:31:21.330 –> 00:31:30.270
Michael Anft: Jan, anything happening at West Alabama regarding internships, practicums, how you handle your exit assessments, things like that. Yeah.
00:31:30.300 –> 00:31:41.310
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Absolutely. We are predominantly an education institution. So, we began as a teacher’s college, so historically, we put a lot of educators out and graduate educators,
00:31:41.670 –> 00:31:52.080
Dr. Jan G. Miller: we have a lot of those. So, for student teaching, we can say that the State Department is working with us and say they are allowing a lot of flexibility, which is wonderful.
00:31:53.040 –> 00:31:58.530
Dr. Jan G. Miller: However, many of our students have stepped up and they want to help teach the K-12 students in an online environment.
00:31:58.740 –> 00:32:04.860
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, if you are assigned to a first grade class, now you’re helping that first grade teacher put content online.
00:32:05.070 –> 00:32:12.060
Dr. Jan G. Miller: They’re teaching reading in small groups online. I mean, they’re being so creative. And we’re so proud of their efforts. So really, the work that they’re doing,
00:32:12.540 –> 00:32:16.860
Dr. Jan G. Miller: they’re going to continue. So, they’re journaling. They’re keeping up with their hours, their activities.
00:32:17.160 –> 00:32:24.390
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And they’re going to be just fine. Of course, we do have, with certification programs, you have exit exams, for instance, practices.
00:32:24.660 –> 00:32:33.930
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Inside the state, will be issuing to this teachers in Alabama what they’re calling a pre Ed CPA license or pre practice license. So,
00:32:34.230 –> 00:32:44.490
Dr. Jan G. Miller: normally, you would have to pass the practice and TPA before you get that licensure. Instead, they’re giving them, like, a window of time, a year and a half. I mean, it’s a really generous window of time
00:32:44.730 –> 00:32:52.320
Dr. Jan G. Miller: to pass those national exams so they can still graduate from our programs, go into the classroom, start teaching. So, that is just fantastic.
00:32:52.650 –> 00:33:04.980
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We also have moved our comprehensive exams to all 100% online. And so that’s been wonderful for students in different programs. That’s not a national test, but that’s in house, but it’s all delivered online.
00:33:05.220 –> 00:33:20.490
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And we’ve implemented best practices where, you know, we give you a window of time to take it any accommodations. I mean, we really have gone above and beyond to make sure there’s comprehensive exams that can still be delivered and taken, you know, very seamlessly.
00:33:21.690 –> 00:33:27.300
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We do have students who are working in a nursing instructional leadership counseling, some of those other
00:33:27.570 –> 00:33:40.260
Dr. Jan G. Miller: fields, but they’re able to continue many of their hours, just in a different format. And I think, Janina, you mentioned simulations. We’re doing a lot with simulation in our nursing programs, athletic training, in education.
00:33:40.800 –> 00:33:52.470
Dr. Jan G. Miller: We, before the pandemic started, we were already using products that have a lot of artificial intelligence. And so, we were piloting and practicing, but we quickly solve the need and the value, and so
00:33:52.710 –> 00:33:59.970
Dr. Jan G. Miller: those simulations are just, I mean, have been wonderful to us. And you guys also mentioned the use of video, and so
00:34:00.600 –> 00:34:03.120
Dr. Jan G. Miller: if a student’s demonstrating a reading list, and
00:34:03.510 –> 00:34:09.600
Dr. Jan G. Miller: you know, through Zoom online and gets recorded, she can submit that to the instructor.
00:34:09.810 –> 00:34:20.760
Dr. Jan G. Miller: The instructor, then, can turn the camera on himself or herself and say, you know, you could have done it this way or like the way you did it that way. And so, we’re trying to make our feedback also be very face to face.
00:34:21.540 –> 00:34:27.870
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So again, we’re not letting those exit requirements stumble or prohibit anyone from graduating.
00:34:28.590 –> 00:34:35.970
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Likewise, we are seeing now, because of the pandemic expanding, you know, to insurance requirements. So, now we,
00:34:36.270 –> 00:34:50.100
Dr. Jan G. Miller: I know we were talking about exit. But then comes the issue of, you know, how do you get transcripts and, you know, how do I take the practices needed to get into a program. And so, we are offering flexibility coming into programs as well as exiting.
00:34:50.700 –> 00:34:57.900
Michael Anft: Great. Fantastic. Thanks, all of you for your thoughts on that question. I’m going to throw another question out to all of you. Okay, if you’re ready.
00:34:58.230 –> 00:35:09.420
Michael Anft: We have seen many questions about engaging learners beyond the video conference room. We’ve already started to talk about that, what strategies have you implemented or seem to be the most successful for you? Anything specific.
00:35:16.500 –> 00:35:17.250
Michael Anft: Thoughts?
00:35:18.570 –> 00:35:21.750
David Migliorese: I mean I can, I can talk generally about what I’ve heard, I think.
00:35:23.280 –> 00:35:31.980
David Migliorese: I mean, one thing folks are confounded by sometimes, it’s how do I get away from, like, the long lecture format in Zoom, which may work better in person.
00:35:33.150 –> 00:35:42.810
David Migliorese: You know, and are, you know, I’m not an anti-lecture person. I certainly am an active learning first kind of person. I think lectures can be a great part of a sort of a balanced diet if they’re done right.
00:35:43.200 –> 00:35:49.680
David Migliorese: And so, one of the things I often say is, like, what are you asking students to do before you bring them in to teach them the content, right? Oftentimes,
00:35:49.950 –> 00:35:58.860
David Migliorese: folks are nervous to ask them to try it before they hear the lecture. It’s actually, it actually makes a better lecture. Usually when students come in having tried it and maybe made some mistakes,
00:35:59.520 –> 00:36:07.770
David Migliorese: you’ll get a better discussion going to begin with. But you also probably don’t need to do that whole lecture. Your people are very used to consuming things on video, and they feel that’s more efficient for them.
00:36:08.100 –> 00:36:14.610
David Migliorese: Especially if you can break it up into smaller pieces, so that they can, like, refer back to it while they’re trying to work on an application, activity,
00:36:15.180 –> 00:36:26.490
David Migliorese: etc. Another thing we hear about Zoom classes in general is that discussion can be sort of difficult. You know, people aren’t really accustomed to being on video, and they’re self-conscious.
00:36:27.270 –> 00:36:31.470
David Migliorese: The social dynamics are just different. And we’re not all adapted to that, and so,
00:36:31.890 –> 00:36:39.600
David Migliorese: you know, there are tools in Zoom that can help with that, like polls or something. If you find that no one’s answering your questions that you throw out to the group,
00:36:39.960 –> 00:36:49.650
David Migliorese: maybe have them vote on an answer and then see where everybody sits, and then it’s easier for a person to speak up and explain why they, you know, along with 40% of the class, what they thought,
00:36:51.540 –> 00:36:58.050
David Migliorese: you know, that might help spur conversation. Also, you might have to break the tension, make it safe to ask a question.
00:36:58.320 –> 00:37:08.580
David Migliorese: You might have to use wait time a lot, you know, more prominently than you’re used to in the classroom where you really have to let that silence kind of settle in, so people can understand, like, you’re just going to wait, you know.
00:37:09.330 –> 00:37:14.340
David Migliorese: And that often create some space for stuff. But I mean, but outside of Zoom,
00:37:14.730 –> 00:37:22.830
David Migliorese: like, we always favor project work in general as kind of the core of an active learning experience, online or face to face, and you could augment the project work with
00:37:23.100 –> 00:37:28.800
David Migliorese: a buddy system, group assignments. You can do office hours where folks get help on the project work.
00:37:29.790 –> 00:37:37.350
David Migliorese: We can do mastery learning, you know, for different topics like math – it’s great for that with, you know, folks working on their own. If you have the right curriculum and the right
00:37:37.770 –> 00:37:47.100
David Migliorese: tools available to you online, they can do a lot of that on their own and then come in for help or, again, work with others. That’s great. If you have a lot of formative assessment and the right tools.
00:37:48.360 –> 00:37:55.020
David Migliorese: Case method teaching is another really, you know, exciting way to interact in a Zoom call. Like, this is just, like,
00:37:55.470 –> 00:38:03.510
David Migliorese: breakdown an actual case, have folks, you know, argue different positions on the case, and leverage the evidence and the analysis that they did prior.
00:38:03.990 –> 00:38:07.830
David Migliorese: And you can have them do a lot of learning prior to the case session so that
00:38:08.280 –> 00:38:17.100
David Migliorese: you know you’ve even got data, maybe on where they fell out in the quiz that you gave them on the content leading up to the session, so that can make it a really useful experience, too.
00:38:18.000 –> 00:38:24.960
David Migliorese: But those are those are some thoughts and some things that I’m hearing. I don’t know if others have experience. You guys are in the trenches.
00:38:26.490 –> 00:38:37.200
Janina Cich: I just wanted to piggyback off what you said. Some of the engagement that we have embedded into our program is students teaching students. So, we have
00:38:38.790 –> 00:38:46.290
Janina Cich: foundational content. We also do practical application exercises, but we also have students break out and either debate a
00:38:47.160 –> 00:38:54.060
Janina Cich: particular topic and come back and show their sides of it, or they’ll put together a PowerPoint voiceover
00:38:54.300 –> 00:39:01.050
Janina Cich: and they’ll explain their points to the students so that they build on that communication skill set as preparing them for career readiness.
00:39:01.380 –> 00:39:12.330
Janina Cich: Or they’ll put together an infographic after they’ve done some research and actually are able to synthesize the information. So, we are trying to build in all those career readiness skill sets, the learning
00:39:13.050 –> 00:39:23.970
Janina Cich: objectives and then also having the students build that confidence in engaging with other people. One on one or in a group. I really enjoyed what you had said earlier about
00:39:24.570 –> 00:39:34.770
Janina Cich: having the students use a lot of the tools that they already use because we’re finding that thatis so valuable right now, especially when they’re navigating through this new norm.
00:39:35.310 –> 00:39:48.990
Janina Cich: We do have a lot of students that are still, as you had mentioned earlier, a little bit fearful of not only how are they going to navigate the classroom, but how are they engaging. So, we’re really clear and provide
00:39:50.130 –> 00:40:00.810
Janina Cich: transparent rules or engagement of how we’re going to host class. So, as I said earlier, we do chunk size activities. So, we might have
00:40:01.320 –> 00:40:09.030
Janina Cich: everybody log on, engage their video and audio. They’ll greet everybody, and then they can turn it off. So, we can
00:40:09.390 –> 00:40:22.320
Janina Cich: address the bandwidth issues. And then when it’s your turn to speak again, turn everything on and then those that are not actively engaging, they’ll be engaging by writing their comments and chat so everybody’s voice is heard.
00:40:22.920 –> 00:40:28.500
Janina Cich: So, we try to be very clear about that. And about the follow up, just as Julie has said earlier.
00:40:28.800 –> 00:40:40.530
Janina Cich: Now that we are reaching out with them more often, we’re finding that instructors are sending out announcements or emails like chat was great. You did a terrific job. These are my takeaways from the chat so that the
00:40:40.890 –> 00:40:46.050
Janina Cich: students know that the instructors engaging with how they’re building their knowledge.
00:40:47.310 –> 00:40:54.990
Michael Anft: Okay, great. Always have this view of a Zoom room and kids raising their hands like they do in regular classes. Some thanks for straighten me out on that.
00:40:55.800 –> 00:40:56.610
David Migliorese: And thanks everyone.
00:40:57.450 –> 00:41:04.440
Michael Anft: Let’s move on to topic number three, which is supporting student well-being in uncertain time. So, people are going through a lot.
00:41:04.830 –> 00:41:12.990
Michael Anft: We’re all going through a lot. Students have so much on our plates, especially these days. You were mentioning the situation for many of your students at West Alabama, Jen.
00:41:14.220 –> 00:41:24.900
Michael Anft: How do we go beyond the classroom? How do we work through this time for content, especially for continuing students during the COVID-19 era, how can we support them through this time?
00:41:25.830 –> 00:41:34.950
Julie Delich: So, this is literally my favorite topic to talk about of all topics. So, we follow an online learner advising model at Wiley.
00:41:35.340 –> 00:41:45.210
Julie Delich: And it’s really based on principles from appreciative advising, proactive advising, and then also throwing in some shame resilience theory and cognitive behavioral theory, and so,
00:41:45.480 –> 00:41:53.190
Julie Delich: to try to make it streamlined, our approach follows what we call the five C’s, which are connect, create,
00:41:53.790 –> 00:42:04.680
Julie Delich: challenge, collaborate, and finally, commit. So, I’ll briefly walk through those, but it’s — connection is what we’ve already been talking about, that personalized engagement, that very human connection
00:42:04.920 –> 00:42:08.790
Julie Delich: between the advisor and the student, and the faculty and the student, it’s so critical.
00:42:09.510 –> 00:42:22.170
Julie Delich: Create is all about what you can control. So, creating a plan of the things that are within your ability to influence. So, really collaborating with the student to develop that kind of plan for their future of what they can plan.
00:42:23.310 –> 00:42:32.610
Julie Delich: Challenges, one of the pieces that’s really critical. challenging the way students are perceiving the reality that’s happening. So, asking them questions like,
00:42:33.000 –> 00:42:46.080
Julie Delich: Okay, well, is that thought helping you right now? Or, Is that thought really accurate? Let’s dissect that a little bit, and helping them design thoughts that are more helpful and more accurate in their current situation.
00:42:47.280 –> 00:42:56.790
Julie Delich: You know, collaborate is all about the advisor and the student working together to design what they want to do for their future and staying on track for their future goals.
00:42:57.270 –> 00:43:08.460
Julie Delich: And then finally, the commitment part. The commitment is so critical for the advisor or the faculty member, working with the student to not only get the student to commit to the next action items and make them specific,
00:43:08.850 –> 00:43:16.110
Julie Delich: but what are you going to do? So, as the advisor, what’s your commitment to the student? Or as the faculty member, what is your specific commitment?
00:43:16.350 –> 00:43:27.540
Julie Delich: So, I’ll follow up with you in a week on this date at this time, or whatever it is, but getting really in the weeds with people and committing to your role as well as what they’re going to be owning.
00:43:27.900 –> 00:43:37.500
Julie Delich: So, that was a very quick whirlwind version of what we focus on to create that meaningful support for students in a uncertain times.
00:43:39.060 –> 00:43:39.780
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Here, Julie.
00:43:40.350 –> 00:43:50.790
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Julie, when you said how much we care, you know, that is so central to everything. And so, our message here at UWA is we do, we care. We care about you.
00:43:51.060 –> 00:43:56.580
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And I’m just so happy that when the call came to shelter in place in the state of Alabama,
00:43:56.970 –> 00:44:08.190
Dr. Jan G. Miller: you know, our university, our president said, you know, wherever we work, whatever we do, we wouldn’t be here without students. So, you know, we have to, they have to know that we care about them and that we are concerned.
00:44:08.520 –> 00:44:21.060
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And so, we quickly were able to support, to remote working, you know, with laptops. We’ve moved all our phone systems to where I can answer my phone from home, you know. A student doesn’t know I’m not sitting at my desk and, instead that, you know,
00:44:21.450 –> 00:44:24.480
Dr. Jan G. Miller: not getting a message — but getting me — is so important.
00:44:24.960 –> 00:44:31.140
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And when we had a student who was going to be taken her comprehensive exam online, and she ran into a glitch, she panicked.
00:44:31.350 –> 00:44:39.660
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, she called, and she gets a real person. You know, we don’t have in. So, can you imagine being in a situation where you might not get a real person. And it’s a comprehensive exam.
00:44:39.930 –> 00:44:51.270
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, my assistant was able to say, Look, this is why we’ll handle it, will take care of it. You know, she was calmed down. And you know, you just can’t put a price tag on care. You know, it just, it just goes so far.
00:44:51.630 –> 00:45:04.710
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Again, transparent communication, you know, from our president as new information would come forward. We were totally transparent with our students, many of them had to move out of housing and go back home, they were concerned.
00:45:05.100 –> 00:45:15.330
Dr. Jan G. Miller: You know, and I just cannot stress the point that we do care. And we are going to take care of you. We have international students who couldn’t leave campus, you know, we had to take care of them.
00:45:15.960 –> 00:45:26.340
Dr. Jan G. Miller: So, we had to have a plan in place, and it all routes in the importance of caring, and I was glad to hear, Julie, say, that is, obviously, you know, central across everywhere.
00:45:27.480 –> 00:45:38.550
Michael Anft: Okay, thanks. Thanks, Jen. Thanks, Julie. What about compassion or strategies for maintaining the mental and emotional well-being of educators and administrators? People on campus who have to
00:45:39.660 –> 00:45:46.860
Michael Anft: you know, be resilient and certain and solid at the same time, even as the things are happening, their lives?
00:45:47.130 –> 00:45:51.120
Dr. Jan G. Miller: True, I can say, at the University of West Alabama, our
00:45:51.630 –> 00:45:58.350
Dr. Jan G. Miller: head administration wanted to practice, you know, social distancing, wanted to practice — let’s have our meetings via Zoom.
00:45:58.620 –> 00:46:05.700
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Let’s, you know, if we’re going to be the key leaders at this institution, we need to stand strong to faculty to say, this can be done, and it will be done
00:46:05.940 –> 00:46:12.540
Dr. Jan G. Miller: because we’re doing it. So, you know, we have academic meetings, we continue to have them. We just demonstrate them through a different mechanism.
00:46:12.780 –> 00:46:23.790
Dr. Jan G. Miller: But he was insistent that, you know, we be the leaders, and we model this, and we support our faculty, just like we do our students. So, going back to that, we have a help desk system in place.
00:46:24.120 –> 00:46:32.190
Dr. Jan G. Miller: If a faculty member’s not sure how to do something, he or she could send that in, and I mean, within hours, their Help Desk ticket is answered.
00:46:32.370 –> 00:46:43.920
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Many times, that’s with a phone call, a demonstration where we might take over their computer screen to show how you navigate and how you do different things, but compassion and care for faculty and students is essential.
00:46:45.030 –> 00:46:51.300
Julie Delich: Yeah, and I’m going to piggyback off of that, Jen. I think I warned you all my mental health background was going to come raging out. So, here it is.
00:46:52.020 –> 00:47:03.990
Julie Delich: So, the mental health of our advisors and our faculty is so mission critical right now. We can’t give what we don’t have. We have to take care of ourselves in order to be there and care for our students.
00:47:04.350 –> 00:47:17.790
Julie Delich: So, those five C’s I went through like a whirlwind before, we’ve actually done trainings to utilize those ourselves as advisors and faculty, so connect with your peers, with people you care about, make sure that’s a priority for you.
00:47:18.300 –> 00:47:24.450
Julie Delich: Focus on what you’re grateful for. Gratitude is one of the fastest ways to pull us out of a negative spiral.
00:47:25.470 –> 00:47:41.010
Julie Delich: Create your own self-care plan, whether it’s a spiritual practice or yoga or breathing or whatever it is, create a plan for your own well-being so that you can role model that, but so you can just genuinely take care of yourself
00:47:41.520 –> 00:47:47.820
Julie Delich: and challenge your thinking. So, all that stuff I talked about — is it true and is it helpful — that applies to us, too.
00:47:48.360 –> 00:47:57.450
Julie Delich: So, check your own thinking and make sure that you’re utilizing those kind of reframing tools, of having accurate and helpful thoughts.
00:47:57.810 –> 00:48:11.010
Julie Delich: And then finally, collaborate and commit, you know. Find support, find people that will work with you and make an action plan for yourself that you write down and commit to take care of your own needs. So, you can be there for your students.
00:48:11.850 –> 00:48:20.370
Michael Anft: Right. Thanks for all the thoughtful responses, folks. Let’s move on to what our audience is thinking. Let’s move on to their questions. I’m going to read a few of these
00:48:21.450 –> 00:48:27.360
Michael Anft: that we have already. There’s more coming in. I wanted to alert people once again to our Twitter.
00:48:31.200 –> 00:48:33.030
Michael Anft: See, where am I? Okay, we are
00:48:39.330 –> 00:48:48.540
Michael Anft: virtual learning chat, hashtag virtual learning chat. You can get in touch with us via, there you can, you can ask questions, make comments, etc. We already have a good bit of questions.
00:48:50.100 –> 00:48:52.350
Michael Anft: Everybody got that? Because I’m taking the screen down. Okay.
00:48:54.450 –> 00:49:01.410
Michael Anft: Participants have the ability to upload the questions as well. So, feel free to do that as we move along. I’m going to direct
00:49:01.980 –> 00:49:08.940
Michael Anft: each one of these two individual panels at first, but everyone else should feel free to chime in when, if they have something to add. Right, so.
00:49:09.330 –> 00:49:19.320
Michael Anft: The first is for Jan Miller or Janina Cich. An audience member wants to know if there are any strategies to support weak learners, you know, remember virtual environment.
00:49:23.280 –> 00:49:33.150
Dr. Jan G. Miller: I can start doing if you want. Um, we are, we are trying to do a lot of one on one instruction with our students. So, with Zoom, for instance, a tool like this,
00:49:33.420 –> 00:49:40.320
Dr. Jan G. Miller: we can, it’s just like we’re sitting across the desk from each other. So, if we see that a student is in need, or he or she may not understand the math concept,
00:49:40.590 –> 00:49:48.270
Dr. Jan G. Miller: we can turn up the Whiteboard feature and, you know, demonstrate and one on one. We’re doing a lot of small group, a lot of one on one instruction,
00:49:48.840 –> 00:50:00.360
Dr. Jan G. Miller: which has been very helpful. And I think, Janina, you spoke to earlier, the importance of the study groups. We are seeing that our students are coming together and wanting to work. You know, where they normally meet in the library, well, now they’re doing it
00:50:00.930 –> 00:50:08.010
Dr. Jan G. Miller: virtually. And again, providing online tutorial services. We have in place for our online students
00:50:08.250 –> 00:50:25.020
Dr. Jan G. Miller: an online tutorial service. We also have an on-campus version, but since we moved everything online, We now have opened up our online tutorial to all students. So, predominantly, that’s to help with math and English and writing, and those kind of support mechanisms are definitely in place.
00:50:26.730 –> 00:50:32.880
Janina Cich: Agree with you. I’m just going to touch on what you and Julie had mentioned earlier about the struggles that some of our students have and so,
00:50:33.240 –> 00:50:42.540
Janina Cich: those that we might consider as weak learners could also have problems with self-motivation, and that self-motivation transitioning from face to face, where they have to show up,
00:50:42.930 –> 00:50:49.830
Janina Cich: To online, where they can hide behind their cameras, so to speak, there’s some different tools or elements that we could use and
00:50:50.160 –> 00:51:00.420
Janina Cich: being really cognizant of what they’re going through. So, the one on one as you had mentioned, Jan, is really important because if we can hear their voice, we can also gauge how they’re showing up.
00:51:00.930 –> 00:51:07.110
Janina Cich: By having a one on one video, we can see how they’re showing up. So, a lot of those behaviors are really important for us.
00:51:07.380 –> 00:51:12.660
Janina Cich: Some of the tools that we’ve used to help students that maybe you’re having some difficulty with this transition
00:51:13.020 –> 00:51:23.160
Janina Cich: are to maybe go old school, have them look at a calendar on their smartphone or go back to the calendar or planner travel is really a great tool for students to manage
00:51:23.640 –> 00:51:35.130
Janina Cich: their classes, especially since now it’s online. I don’t know about any of you, but all my days and all the hours are blending together, that it’s really difficult for me sometimes to stay on task as well.
00:51:35.790 –> 00:51:38.820
Janina Cich: As far as self-motivating, another really great tool is
00:51:39.420 –> 00:51:47.400
Janina Cich: Cold Turkey. I don’t know if you’ve heard about it, but Cold Turkey is a really terrific app that students can use so that they can stay focused. It’ll
00:51:47.730 –> 00:51:59.100
Janina Cich: actually put their Facebook or their Twitter or their social media or even the internet itself on hold during that timeframe, while they’re in class. So, that also helps
00:51:59.730 –> 00:52:09.750
Janina Cich: keep them focused, and then they can take a look at some of the analytics behind it so that they can see where their time wasters are. So those are a couple of tools that we’ve implemented as well.
00:52:11.730 –> 00:52:13.230
Michael Anft: Great trick.
00:52:13.800 –> 00:52:16.230
David Migliorese: Question, quick plug, if I could. Before we go, we have a ton of
00:52:16.650 –> 00:52:20.940
David Migliorese: resources available on our website that we’ve made available for free. As a result of the COVID
00:52:21.900 –> 00:52:30.750
David Migliorese: era and services at Wiley.com, feel free to go there and get support. We have one on one live support with our instructional designers, as well, if that’s something that’s interesting
00:52:31.500 –> 00:52:39.810
David Migliorese: to you, and we have a Center for Teaching and Learning (CTS) that really come where you can go and find a lot of support for these specific situations. Great.
00:52:39.870 –> 00:52:45.090
Michael Anft: Thanks. Thanks for sharing that. Janine up, I’m going to direct this question from an audience member to you as well.
00:52:45.840 –> 00:52:58.890
Michael Anft: Do you have any thoughts or suggestions on how to establish an online teaching norm of video on? The writer feels that there might be pedagogical merit and having that. Any ideas?
00:52:59.910 –> 00:53:11.580
Janina Cich: Absolutely. I think I touched on this a little bit earlier, and many of us have, is that being really clear with our expectations and helping students find a new routine is really important.
00:53:12.030 –> 00:53:22.650
Janina Cich: So, as we’re engaging in a different reality of virtual learning, and like the term virtual because it’s really as a temporary situation that we’re moving face to face
00:53:23.100 –> 00:53:31.530
Janina Cich: to an online environment, is to be clear and intentional. Have them prepared before they come to class on particular material so that
00:53:31.800 –> 00:53:39.390
Janina Cich: when they come, it’s more about a conversation. It’s not about, I’m going to be teaching you this, and you’re going to listen to me for an hour.
00:53:39.690 –> 00:53:49.590
Janina Cich: It’s a conversation so that we can really dive into some of the content and also about the navigation of the video and audio is really important as well.
00:53:50.610 –> 00:53:56.400
Janina Cich: More often than not, in all of my classes, I’ll put in the Whiteboard or explain beforehand how we’d like them to
00:53:56.670 –> 00:54:06.600
Janina Cich: arrive to class. When you show up, please put your video and audio on, greet the instructor and everyone in class, you can mute yourself and turn your video off if you’d like,
00:54:06.960 –> 00:54:15.600
Janina Cich: but when you participate, I’m expecting you to turn that back on again so that we can see one another and be in the same virtual classroom together.
00:54:16.230 –> 00:54:25.440
Janina Cich: For the engagement during class, because I’m not seeing everyone on camera, usually I’ll use CAHOOTS or a poll within class.
00:54:25.830 –> 00:54:38.820
Janina Cich: And I’ll have students type in chat if they’re not on camera answering. They need to type into the chat their answer or comment to one another as well so that we have all of this engagement going on at once.
00:54:39.240 –> 00:54:58.590
Janina Cich: And then, as everybody has mentioned here, show up, lead by example, and your presence is really important for the social and cognitive development of students from pre-K through adult education. That’s really important that we lead by example and our presence is known as well.
00:54:59.490 –> 00:55:00.720
Michael Anft: Fantastic. Thank you.
00:55:01.830 –> 00:55:16.260
Michael Anft: There’s a question here that has a psych dimension to it. So, it’s got Julie Delich’s name written all over it. A participant wants to know, Do you have any insights or strategies for working with students with mental health issues by remote learning environments?
00:55:16.380 –> 00:55:29.640
Julie Delich: Oh, that’s such an important question because even people that previously did not have mental health issues are now starting to experience a lot of symptomology as a result of the intense stress and changes to their environment.
00:55:30.120 –> 00:55:35.310
Julie Delich: One of the most stressful things a human can experience is not being able to control what’s happening around you
00:55:35.640 –> 00:55:45.870
Julie Delich: and still having responsibilities. So, as far as strategies go, it really reflects back on everything we’ve been talking about already, about that personalized connection,
00:55:46.290 –> 00:55:49.290
Julie Delich: about the outreach before you see signs of trouble.
00:55:49.920 –> 00:55:58.020
Julie Delich: And then I would really suggest that you talk to your counseling centers and find out from your campus resources what’s available
00:55:58.260 –> 00:56:09.300
Julie Delich: or their virtual tools available, their virtual sessions available, and utilize those resources and share them widely, even with students that haven’t disclosed a challenge.
00:56:09.810 –> 00:56:17.340
Julie Delich: Because there’s so much going on right now. So, the Counseling Center is, I think, your best option to find out ways to support those learners.
00:56:17.970 –> 00:56:29.760
Michael Anft: Good. Great. Thank you, Julie. Here’s one for David and Jen. Writer wants to know, Is less content and a new content syllabus a solution? Or where should, should we stick to the curriculum?
00:56:32.070 –> 00:56:33.870
David Migliorese: Yeah, I’ll let you take that one. That’s how long.
00:56:35.400 –> 00:56:43.140
Dr. Jan G. Miller: Well, at the University of West Alabama, we’re pretty much stay on the course, if you will. We were midstream, you know, with the course. And so, we just
00:56:43.440 –> 00:56:50.190
Dr. Jan G. Miller: on-boarded the current curriculum in place online. We’ll be doing the same predominantly in the summer term as well.
00:56:50.610 –> 00:56:56.820
Dr. Jan G. Miller: What we will be doing is modifying assignments to fit an online format. So again, if it was
00:56:57.120 –> 00:57:06.030
Dr. Jan G. Miller: an assignment where she didn’t, had to teach a small group of students, obviously she’s not going to be able to do that, you know, this summer. So, we are coming up with alternative solutions.
00:57:06.300 –> 00:57:17.490
Dr. Jan G. Miller: There are videos in place. There are all sorts of tools that we’ll be using. So, I would say the curriculum is pretty much staying the same, but we are modifying the assignments to fit an online environment. Yeah.
00:57:17.670 –> 00:57:23.790
David Migliorese: I like that, yeah. I’m sort of a purist when I — your questions like that, I think, well, if the course is supposed to result in these competencies, then
00:57:24.240 –> 00:57:29.940
David Migliorese: you didn’t succeed if you didn’t, you know, meet those competencies. So, I think if you can’t, you know,
00:57:30.690 –> 00:57:41.700
David Migliorese: modify, then try to kind of retrench and figure out what’s reasonable, but I would try to stick to that and really assess folks that you have a credible degree at the end of the day, right, when all this is over.
00:57:42.240 –> 00:57:44.940
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And really, they’re learning new skills and new tools that,
00:57:45.300 –> 00:57:57.120
Dr. Jan G. Miller: you know, we have a limit. But let’s turn into eliminate so they’re leaving with more skills than they would have had, had we not had this pandemic. So, you know, we look for that silver lining. There’s always something to, you know, take away.
00:57:57.900 –> 00:58:06.300
Michael Anft: Right, right. Well, great, thanks. I’d like to thank our participants for their questions and our panelists for giving us such thoughtful answers.
00:58:06.840 –> 00:58:19.080
Michael Anft: If there are questions that have gone on answered, and I see we’ve just gotten a bunch in — dozen and a half in the past 30 minutes or so — we’ll try to get answers back to people by email, Twitter, whatever means we can.
00:58:20.190 –> 00:58:25.620
Michael Anft: I’d like to ask our panelists, before we go, as we’re winding up here, their thoughts on what the future might hold
00:58:26.040 –> 00:58:37.440
Michael Anft: for traditional classes. Once we get through the times we’re living through right now, what do you see in your crystal ball in terms of the mix between virtual online and traditional courses? This is going to change things.
00:58:38.460 –> 00:58:46.680
Dr. Jan G. Miller: I personally think you’re going to see a more blended approach in the future. I can see where pure on-campus people are going to see some value and some benefit
00:58:46.890 –> 00:58:55.860
Dr. Jan G. Miller: to teaching online, especially some of the tools and the integration of tools. So, my prediction is you’re going to see more blended and more coming together than so segmented.
00:58:57.240 –> 00:59:04.200
Michael Anft: Some of the questions we’re gonna have to deal with, cost and whether more virtual learning is going to increase the cost of education.
00:59:05.220 –> 00:59:07.950
Michael Anft: Got several, four or five questions like that. What do you think?
00:59:11.910 –> 00:59:12.780
00:59:13.980 –> 00:59:28.230
Janina Cich: Pilots that have just gone out in 2018, I recently read about where central Georgia Tech and University of Minnesota, St. Thomas. I’m sorry, University of St. Thomas and Minnesota did a test pilot where they
00:59:29.130 –> 00:59:38.220
Janina Cich: in our terms, we would have thought it was blended. But what they did is they took the three different learning structures — face to face, synchronous, and asynchronous — and they combined it into one structured
00:59:38.490 –> 00:59:46.260
Janina Cich: learning environment, and they are test piloting that, giving the students have choice and which learning environment is better for them
00:59:46.860 –> 01:00:00.600
Janina Cich: to make that connection. And I thought that was really interesting. So, that alone should be interesting to find out if they’re reaching enrollment, retention, and learning objectives throughout that different approach to teaching.
01:00:01.980 –> 01:00:12.150
Dr. Jan G. Miller: And Michael, at our university, we’ve actually evaluated tuition. So, I mean it’s within dollars difference. And so, where before online may have been a little more expensive,
01:00:12.960 –> 01:00:19.830
Dr. Jan G. Miller: you know, it’s now the students get to make that choice. And so, you know, and so, it’ll be interesting to see how that plays out as well.
01:00:20.760 –> 01:00:21.720
Michael Anft: Right, okay.
01:00:22.230 –> 01:00:24.330
David Migliorese: I mean, I don’t think you know.
01:00:25.140 –> 01:00:31.290
David Migliorese: I think after all is said and done, it’d be hard to imagine a world where we’re online. It’s not more mainstream than it is today, but I think,
01:00:31.980 –> 01:00:40.380
David Migliorese: from my perspective, quality distinctions will matter more. I think people will be smarter about what online learning can be and what they like, and you know, how it’s best delivered, and
01:00:41.850 –> 01:00:49.260
David Migliorese: I think schools will have to look at the demand for the different models out there and decide what their cost structure needs to be and what their product strategy needs to be to meet that demand.
01:00:49.680 –> 01:01:03.450
David Migliorese: And that may change the cost dynamics on their side. If they don’t have to maintain, kind of, too massively expensive, you know, delivery models in the same, you know, to the same degree, that can kind of modify their balance.
01:01:04.620 –> 01:01:16.530
Julie Delich: Yeah, and I think from an advertising perspective, it’s all about making sure you’re reaching out to online learners in the way that they need to be connected with, which is different than running into somebody on campus and checking in with someone in person.
01:01:16.830 –> 01:01:20.340
Julie Delich: So, investing in the advising resources is really an opportunity
01:01:20.670 –> 01:01:29.940
Julie Delich: but not at the expense of raising tuition and harming students with lots of fees. You’ll need to find a way to mitigate those costs from other resources.
01:01:31.980 –> 01:01:32.640
Michael Anft: Anyone else?
01:01:34.140 –> 01:01:40.440
Michael Anft: Okay, let’s wrap it up, then. I want to thank our panelists, participants, and technical staff for making our webinar roll today.
01:01:40.890 –> 01:01:50.430
Michael Anft: Thank you so much. We’ve discussed in some depth student engagement in virtual learning environments, how to get faculty more attuned with that and more comfortable with that,
01:01:51.030 –> 01:02:07.890
Michael Anft: how to reach out to students during these difficult times using virtual tools, how to get an idea of how best to run those virtual experiences, what they mean. And the overall tapestry of higher education and how to build resiliency and students through these experiences.
01:02:08.970 –> 01:02:16.260
Michael Anft: Which is quite a bit to go over now. So, I salute you for doing that. I’m sure thought leaders and campus officials and others in the future will be discussing
01:02:16.500 –> 01:02:25.260
Michael Anft: what will have been learned about virtual learning during this tough time we’re all going through, during this pandemic. In the meantime, let’s stay in touch.
01:02:27.870 –> 01:02:28.590
Michael Anft: We’re going to be
01:02:30.180 –> 01:02:43.140
Michael Anft: able to give you more resources at HTTPS dot double backslash ed services.com which you should see on your screen. Right. Well, excuse me.
01:02:46.530 –> 01:02:47.700
Michael Anft: One second here.
01:02:53.520 –> 01:02:56.250
Michael Anft: Hey, well, you have, you have the, you have the,
01:02:59.010 –> 01:03:10.620
Michael Anft: you have the address. So, let’s end it right there. We can also continue the conversation on Twitter using hashtag virtual learning chat. Again, thanks to you all. Stay healthy and safe out there, and have a great afternoon.
01:03:10.800 –> 01:03:11.310
David Migliorese: Thanks, Michael.
01:03:12.000 –> 01:03:13.170
Michael Anft: Thanks, everyone. Thank you.
01:03:13.290 –> 01:03:13.800
Janina Cich: Bye bye.
01:03:13.830 –> 01:03:15.180
Julie Delich: Take care of you and stay safe.
01:03:15.750 –> 01:03:16.230